Subject: word search tool for Scrabble
Date: Mon Nov 26 08:07:45 2018
User: Denny
Message:As I say in the MOTF I'm still playing Scrabble on my phone using the Words By Post app. I use a tool I built (linked below) to search for words.
Is it cheating to use a word search tool? There is still plenty of strategy and the word search tool is far from definitive. Others obviously use similar tools as folks will play OSTOYAE against you. I try to never go *that* far.
Link: wordme.net
Date: Mon Nov 26 09:11:53 2018
User: Sassquatch
Message:Can you not post long messages. I can't click the ignore/close button
Date: Mon Nov 26 09:14:23 2018
User: joeygray
Message:Funny you should ask.
A lot of us here, myself included, have insisted for years and years that solving a freecell.net game by dealing out the same layout with a deck of cards, making moves and then taking them back if they lead to a losing position until a winnng line is found, and then repeating that winning line on this site so as to get your record-keeping system to say it was won on the first try -- is cheating. As far as I know, and I think I would, you have never yourself weighed in on this discussion (not that I would know if you had as a hidden alias).
Care to?
Date: Mon Nov 26 11:22:23 2018
User: TNmountainman
Message:He *has* said that "it's not in the spirit of the game".
Date: Mon Nov 26 11:54:19 2018
User: jamesblackburn-lynch
Message:Oh my god, Denny, of course it's cheating! I just looked at your little tool. There really isn't much left of the game with that tool.
Do you have one for crosswords too?
James
Date: Mon Nov 26 12:02:54 2018
User: joeygray
Message:Heh heh. I do 'cheat' on crosswords from time to time, when I consider the design to be unfair: like when they cross two obscure proper names, there's no way in hell I'm ever going to know either of those even when I'm down to the one crossing letter. But most often I'll just ball up the newspaper and trash it when that happens. Hard but fair crosswords, they're very satisfying. Unfair ones are a thorn in my side.
Date: Mon Nov 26 12:24:29 2018
User: The_Interpreter
Message:jamesblackburn-lynch, I would be careful in referring to Denny's "little tool". A misunderstanding could lead to a cataclysmic catastrophe involving your streaks.
Date: Mon Nov 26 16:19:26 2018
User: jamesblackburn-lynch
Message:But I complimented the quality of his tool.
Date: Mon Nov 26 20:42:47 2018
User: sprucegoose
Message:"I use a tool I built [myself] " - well this is supercool, but still would be an unfair advantage if others didn't use them. I leave that to you to decide whether your opponent is doing so. Nonetheless it still seems a tad LanceArmstrongesque in that "everybody" doped, he just did it better - to level the playing field - but since it's not an official tournament with judges assuring all adhere to the same rules, I guess I am back to your evaluation of your opponent.
When I played Scrabble IRL over the lunchhour for several years we allowed the use of an OSPD3 during play.
Being somewhat competitive, I memorized all 95 two-letter words from the OSPD and had a list of front and back hooks, memorized other oddities, all the seven-letter words containing the five vowels, all 7-letter words containing the letters of my kid's names...
Some games, I forwent winning to play thematic words, I still remember a game near Chrstmas when I had JOY, GIFT, TREE, PRESENT, and a couple others.
Date: Mon Nov 26 21:02:39 2018
User: Denny
Message:It's pretty obvious that sometimes I'm playing against tools. No one knows words like ATIGI and SWARF and ELMY and HAE.
Date: Mon Nov 26 21:18:40 2018
User: wcwally
Message:No way. If you're doing it by yourself: your rules. If you're playing in a competition with someone else: Establish the rules you both play with.
Date: Mon Nov 26 23:34:38 2018
User: PizzaPete
Message:Just glad you created this awesome Freecell site in your other spare time and if you are playing scrabble checking a dictionary you are hopefully gaining knowledge... a good thing.
Date: Tue Nov 27 00:13:42 2018
User: lightfield
Message:i would like to play scrabble on my laptop. can someone recommend a site that doesn't have a lot of ads and spyware?
Date: Tue Nov 27 07:12:14 2018
User: The_Revelator
Message:Personally, I feel that anyone who obviously cheats (by using a tool) will, alongside the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, will spend eternity in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur.
Does that seem harsh?
Date: Tue Nov 27 08:38:25 2018
User: Denny
Message:Ha! Ok, well the fires of hell await my soul after that last round of tiles as NOSFERATU comes for me.
Date: Tue Nov 27 09:02:00 2018
User: TitanicTony
Message:Stupid, imo! The "Assent of Man" is completely dependent on the use of tools!
Date: Tue Nov 27 10:02:52 2018
User: joeygray
Message:I do not know what the "Assent of Man" is.
However, if I understand from context what sort of thing you mean by it, then I doubt it has anything to do with a level playing field in a competition.
Date: Tue Nov 27 10:27:50 2018
User: TNmountainman
Message:You're right. He means the ascent of *some* men by stepping on *other* men. As one could describe the 'progression' of civilization in part by that modality. Thus Neanderthals (mostly) and wooly mammoths went away. Etc.
That said, he was probably borrowing the phrase from the BBC series of that name, hosted by Jacob(?) Bronowski(?) from about, oh, 30+ years ago. It was a great series, actually, but I don't think freecell was mentioned.
Date: Tue Nov 27 10:51:34 2018
User: TitanicTony
Message:Yes, it WAS a great series; I really enjoyed it!
Date: Wed Nov 28 07:54:26 2018
User: rbf
Message:Going back to the question. For me it's cheating.
Having said that when I play my brother I am allowed to check speelling, since my speeling has become so bad.
Date: Wed Nov 28 09:14:19 2018
User: joeygray
Message:If, in a game in which all competitors know the rules and agree to them, no such agreed rule is violated, then there is no cheating. So if Denny and his opponent(s) agree that word-search assistance is allowed, then it is. However, if there is (like we have here in freecell) an overarching results database and not all the competitors reflected in the database know about or agree to some enhancement rule, then those following such a rule 'might be' cheating some others not following such rules.
I don't know what the situation is in these online scrabble-type games, but if there is some kind of rating or handicap system affecting more than just whoever is playing an instance of the game, then there had better be an explicit "word-search assistance is allowed" rule known to all players or I'd call using one cheating. I don't subscribe to the ideas of "well, nobody can stop it so it's not cheating" or "obviously everybody does it so it's not cheating". On the other hand, if every instance really is just between two people then they can agree to whatever rules they want.
Date: Wed Nov 28 20:54:54 2018
User: ix
Message:the question seemed like a wind up to me, i'm surprised at the attention it got. am i just a cynical bastard?
Date: Wed Nov 28 21:10:58 2018
User: ix
Message:should have read: perhaps i'm a cynical bastard, i wasn't actually soliciting a response
Date: Thu Nov 29 12:26:50 2018
User: sprucegoose
Message:When I played Scrabble in college (while getting my masters degree in engineering) I memorized a few word lists. HAE is a slam dunk. It is a hook from two letter words, twice. Add an E to the end of HA, add an H to the front of AE (memorize all the two letter words, the OSPD3 had only 95, OSPD4 and OWL and SWOPODS(?) have more, like ZA and QI). ELMy seems easy, too. Being in manufacturing engineering, SWARF, is also a slam dunk, leaving only one word on your list - ATIGI which might be on a vowel-dump list someone learned.
We usually had spectators in college and sometimes I played for them. One of the not-playing grad students said to my play "What the hell is NYALA" so later in the game I played AI - a two toed sloth (which again had him shaking his head and asking what it meant) but playing AI was only a setup to really burn this kids bacon by hooking UN to the front to make UNAI. In incredulity he asked about it. I explained that the prefix UN means NOT (and gave examples) so *obviously* an UNAI is NOT a two-toed sloth, it's a three-toed sloth.
He never asked about any words I played again.
FWIW, we had one PhD professor who only won about once a month, the usual winners were the two non-degreed office secretaries who were voracious readers. I learned the lists/words I did to beat these *old* ladies. Joyce and Katherine.
Date: Sat Dec 1 12:38:59 2018
User: KeeltoTop
Message:
It is not cheating if all the players use the app.
Date: Tue Dec 4 16:25:53 2018
User: Katya
Message:Hi, lightfield.
I don't have any suggestions for Scrabble on your computer. However I have Scrabble on my original first generation iPad which plays like a charm - no ads, can play with other people or vs computer, etc. So I checked the app store and a newer version of that Scrabble exists. The free one seems loaded with ads. But since I had purchased my original game I was able to download the new premium ad-free version for free onto a new iPad. It plays fine, but has some features that I find annoying. For example when you add letters to the board it magnifies them in the process until they actually are placed. Also there is a "teacher" who tells you after each move what your best word would've been, often something totally obscure. Those features can't be turned off. I think especially the teacher should be because often its suggestion for best word can be used on your next turn and against a live opponent would be unfair. Anyway this version seems to be the best one I've seen, annoying features or not. You might consider downloading the free version on a tablet and see if whether, ad-free, it would be worth purchasing.
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